“Usse farak padega kya?” – Excerpts
Thanks to Sanjeev for alerting me to this thought-provoking interview of Arvind Kejriwal (at JaagoRe.com). Excerpt from a response by Arvind (emphasis mine):
Last year in July, when a large number of MPs, during no confidence motion against Manmohan Singh government, crossed sides after taking bribes…I thought that was one of the darkest days for Indian democracy. If such large number of MPs could be sold and purchased, that means we are not an independent country.
Tomorrow any country can purchase any number of MPs and get any law passed in our parliament. It really shook me inside.
Continued below…
“If people are sleeping in the country, democracy will not function.†(Image Courtesy: JaagoRe)
Unfortunate(ly)..the next day there was not a single murmur of protest from any civil society..anywhere in the country. No one protested. No one came in the street and said, ‘This behavior is not acceptable to us.’
I called up a couple of people, a couple of friends, and said, ‘Let’s go to India Gate. Let’s go to protest. Let’s say that this is not acceptable to us.’
Most of the people said—‘Usse farak padega kya?’ Will it change? Will it affect in any manner?
So I counter-questioned them- Don’t you actually spend so much time with your family? Don’t you go the movies?
Usse kuchh farak padta hai kya aapki family ke upar? If we spend so much time with our family, we if do so much for our family, don’t we also need to spend that much time with/for the society rather than question ‘Isse farak padega kya?’
We should question but kuchh to karo society ke liye, chalo… [do something].
You’re asking me that going to India Gate is not going to work. Do something else. But spend a particular percentage of your time for the society, for the country and for the democracy otherwise the democracy will not function. And people who don’t do that, do not have a right to criticize.
Please do share your thoughts and comments below.
Somewhat Related Posts:
Don’t you think this is the general tendency of the Indian people? If it wasn’t, this government would not have ruled the country for so long. A person without responsibility and accountability would not have been a dictator by proxy. Intellectuals in the cabinet would not have been mere puppets. It is sad that the Indian polity has been emasculated and its honor and conscience sold to the highest bidder. It also has become evident that the expatriates like Shantanu, Sanjeev et al have become the only people who speak out, however much they appear to be voices in the wilderness. Ummed hei, kuch toh phark padega in blogs-se!
My only hope is, your blogs act as sparks to spread enlightenment at least in some sections of educated people. May be some day people will wake up and act.
I agree completely with what you have written.If citizens do not protest against wrong-doings by the govt./MPs, they will be emboldened to behave in an increasingly objectionable manner.
I would like to add, though, that protests can be undertaken only occasionally and in exceptional circumstances.
Positive social/ political activities can be untdertaken on a daily basis. Citizens should cultivate the habit of doing something for the society they live in on a regular basis.
‘Jab tak mujhe personally kuch farak nahi padega…I will not care’ is the general tendency of us Indians. Even if it impacts me personally like the price hike, well… someone else is protesting, so that is still fine. One of our state ministers in Andhra says that the buying capacity of people has increased and hence, it does not make any difference if the prices go up! How can anyone beat that?
Unless every citizen does not feel he/she is a part of this great country and he/she needs to give back something, things will not change. It is the responsibility of parents to instill that sense of pride and belonging towards the country in the kids so that this indifference may not affect our future generations.
I agree with Manju when he says protests cannot be undertaken everyday. We need to pick and choose our fights – and that too when we’re sure of our ground.
Politics is so murky right now that you and I being the common people have no real idea of what’s going on. Were bribes really taken? Was it an accusation meant to provoke a response? I don’t trust what politicians say…
And sometimes, we do get together and organize ourselves. Like those who organized a rally for the Bhopal Gas tragedy victims and got the government to cough up more money as compensation – it may not be a complete victory, but at least it’s something…
As for the price rise and the bandh, I do know that without drastic measures, India would be bankrupt by 2013, so sooner or later we had to do this even if it was unpopular.
I can only laugh at the ‘darkest day’ abuse. Politicians need money. He has never discussed formal methods of servicing the needs of a politician nor has he discussed the outlay for a single election. So he never spelt out what is white, therefore, he cannot really know or call anything or person dark in this context.
This ‘holier than Indian politician’ moral stance isn’t going to help anyone, least of all, Dharma. In an ideal world, you might get a politician that satisfies all your criteria. He won’t survive long in politics. He won’t do much good for anyone – neither for himself nor for people who voted for him. And if you elect many such useless saint like guys, your society will be run over by foreign religions, foreign powers, foreign slave-seekers and so on and so forth. Give it a thought.
I completely second you on your statement that politics is so murky right now that, we being the common people dont know what exactly is going on, whether the accusation was simply to gain political mileage. how can we be sure?
about clear cut issues, more people in the country protest, but when its an issue colored by a particular political group, the people dont join in.. and so much so that it has also become a pseudo taboo to be part of a politically colored issue
Food production can not be neglected in India. Agriculture is the mainstay. India’s geographic location makes it one of the most conducive locations on earth for agriculture more than any other activity. It has got the most extensive river systems in the world. And if we are going to neglect that then we are doomed.
If food prices rise in India then everything else does and the common man suffers. If agricultural produce is not good no other market can fare well. And economy goes down. And agricultural produce is indeed going down. Someone may ask but the economy is booming. But this boom is artificial.
We have to take the government to task thru such agitations. but you can take wake up a sleeping soul but for one who is pretending to sleep, not much can be done.
Can India not become a superpower by exploiting its agricultural potential ? I see that it can. Agriculture should remain mainstay of India. Sustainable growth is possible only is such an economy. Agriculture doesn’t produce waste, industry does.
A model to see in this regard is gujarat with 9% agriculture growth as compared to less than half for country as a whole. Farmers from Punjab and Haryana are visiting Gujarat to see the success story and even buying land in Gujarat.
http://www.dnaindia.com/…/main-article_narendra-modi-s-farm-miracle_1358133
There is a need for policy makers who will comply to this vision.
We may go on with our industrial growth but not at the expense of agriculture.
absolutely right.this,i think,is one of the biggest problems with indians.we are pre occupied with only ourselves and our immediate family.the sense of community service or genuine activism is seriously lacking.when it comes to voting,most of the middle and upper class don’t bother.as a result,unscrupulous politicians and criminals buy the poor and get their votes and win to become our ‘leaders’.how can we expect these ‘leaders’ to serve the country.as for daily life,most indians seem to be obsessed with becoming more rich,even at the expense of their poorer countrymen.we are surrounded by people who are less well off than us,but how many of us can say that we have helped even one poor person to come out of the cycle of poverty.that we think is the duty of others.unless each of us feel that we have a duty and responsibility towards our country and countrymen,our country can never progress.
“Usse Fark Padega Kya” needs to be answered correctly and with potency and not some lame excuses. Has the Jaago Re guy got some concrete answers here for people who are result oriented?
Gypsy, Manju, Uma, Bhagwad, Prashant, Madhusudan, Sujatha, QA: Thanks for sharing your thoughts…My quick response(s) below:
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@Gypsy: Thank you for your kind words…
Ummed hei, kuch toh phark padega in blogs-se! Bikul Theek kahaa…But this has to evolve beyond blogs and comments on the internet…Hence my various outreach efforts and offline meetings. discussions etc..Which reminds me..I will be in Indore for a brief 2 days period (31stJul/1st Aug) and we are planning some meetings while I am there…
If anyone reading this is interested, please join the Facebook page where we will have more details in due course; Alternatively, pl leave a comment here. Thanks.
@Manju: More than protest, I feel citizens need to become active…The current indifference is worrying not because citizens do not protest – but because they do not even appear to notice that things are not going well.
@Uma: ‘Jab tak mujhe personally kuch farak nahi padega…I will not care’ is the general tendency of us Indians. Sad but true Uma…but we have fight this tendency and this indifference on a daily basis, day-in, day-out…Otherwise there is really no hope…Thanks
:Bhagwad: And sometimes, we do get together and organize ourselves. Yes..I just hope it happens more often..and happens not just as a reaction but as a spontaneous act..
I remain hopeful that things will change…
@Usse farak padega kya: I will respond to your comment when I have some more time but I have some sympathy for your view that the ‘holier than Indian politician’ moral stance is not particularly helpful.
@Prashant: it has also become a pseudo taboo to be part of a politically colored issue Good one!
@Madhusudan: Thanks for the link and the comment Madhusudan..I do agree with some of your points but economic policy and competitiveness is much more than just agriculture, as I am sure you know. We do need a strong manufacturing base as well as a vibrant services sector.
@Sujatha: Well said, “..unless each of us feel that we have a duty and responsibility towards our country and countrymen,our country can never progress.”
@Q A: Arvind has put his money where his mouth is… I am sure you are aware of his work on RTI…He is walking the talk – more than most of us, I daresay.
@Q A
This is what I could think of:
All of us who have internet connection at their home can start writing over such issues. and can start blogs/ connect people to existing blogs. and bring a change in the mindsets of those whom we influence. In our cirle we can spread the word. Instead of talking about how the football teams fared we can discuss issues that matter to the common Indian. Instead of IPL or movie gossips, lets start exposing pseudo-secularism to our colleagues in office and in get-togethers. If we cannot write we can use the material already available on the internet.
If we have information people will be interested. A nationalist sentiment has to be awakened in all. Remember, not a single communist came to Bengal to propogate his ideology. It was their literature that did us in.
The blogs are our books in this information age.
Some model to follow:
There is a news weekly called National Spirit launched recently.
http://www.haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.aspx?PageID=10752
“If people are sleeping in the country, democracy will not function.â€
I salute this person and have courage to stand with him….
Vandematram…
B Shantanu – you only have to point to a place where politicians are not corrupt. It should be large group – resources should be scarce – meddlesome powerful foreign powers should be around.
Here is a challenge to you. I believe there is no such place on earth that is free of corrupt politicians. If hundreds of padha-likhas choose to pull the wool over their eyes and delude themselves that they are clean and the politicians are not, it is not going to be easy to educate all of them. God help India.
Somewhat unrelated – but in response to Madhusudan at #8, this is what you need to revive agriculture: Narendra Modi’s farm miracle
Do read to understand why farmers from Punjab and Haryana are flocking to Gujarat!
@Shantanu
Thanks for the link. 2 reasons cited for agri-boom in Guj were Micro-irrigation and Staggered & extensive electric supply to villages.Yes, I understand the point that electricity is provided by the industry which is the main ingriedient of guj approach to agri-boom. There are alternative approaches also which I have indicated at the end of this comment.
The reason I posted #8 was to raise awareness of the need to have focus on agriculture.We can’t eat nuts and bolts. We need food to survive. And in plenty with good distribution measure, which can alleviate the suffering of the poor for whom daily meal is 50% of their expenditure. The bandh was rightfully done. At least i spoke to some of my office colleagues about seriousness of the issue. And also gave a talk in the local train while commuting from Grant Road to Borivali on the line of Arvind’s article. They became aware. Farak toh padta hai bhai. Also I copy pasted Arvind Kejriwal’s writing to them and they agreed.
I do agree that manufacturing base is required and thats why I said industry can go on. But this is priority, Agriculture, food production and not food import. http://www.vijayvaani.com/FrmPublicDisplayArticle.aspx?id=1196
Finally I look at it in this way. Somewhere down the line fossil fuels will get exhausted. and electricity generation will be a crisis of sorts. Villages should be made self-dependent, self-sufficient. Retain the manpower in villages.
following links make for an interesting read:
-About poverty index: http://gitagrad.blogspot.com/2009_11_01_archive.html
-Project Ruzizi Valley :
Working Villages International (achieving self-sustainability with Swadeshi movement and Appropriate technology, with minimal dependence on Industry) http://www.workingvillages.org/
Also
A tale of 2 dollars : greenselfreliance.org/two-dollar-tale?format=pdf
Shantanu,
usse kucch farak nehi padega. The question is two fold: our perceived “do-not-care” attitude to democracy and whether our democratic system offers incentive for corrupt practices or not. I have attempted to elaborate on them below:
1. Indian attitude is not very different from common human behavior, why, then, unlike others who have democracy, most of us do not care about democracy? It is easy to blame the lazy aam admi. But that is not the right answer. This is the same lazy aam admi who goes to the office by making an average two hours journey in the early morning every day and returns after spending 7/8 hours in the office and 2 hours in traffic. This is not laziness. But there is indifference towards democracy. why? Because the current democratic system never found cultural root in our country or society. The participatory democracy without a King existed in the country long back (as it did in classic Greek and early Rome), but the western tradition added a question of regular election of the rulers (partially, because one can not choose beaurocratic machinery). This addition came naturally in western civilization as a reaction to the monopoly of the administrative power of king and church. Thus the sanity of democracy and necessity of fair election are held sacred in the developed nation. In our nation, we did not have that tradition, because democracy did not grow out of roots here, it came like a newly painted Christmas tree donated by the neighborhood salvation army.
2. In my motherland, the democracy was as implied as the old aristocracies or the rule of the Caliph post-1200 or rule of the British Monarch post-1757. Aam admi was told that the system would be to vote when they will be asked to vote. Please note that, no guidelines existed on how to choose the the guy you want to elect. PV Kane once criticized the Indian democratic system by stating that the system engenders a false opinion among the people that they have rights, but no obligations. Any power without a string of responsibility offers a window of perversion. Therefore, votes are brought and sold for a kg of rice and Rs. 20/-. Consequently, people got what they paid for. If a system is treated like a whore, what respect or love would you have for that system? Food for thought.
Now, it is nearly impossible to establish a norm for responsibility. Narendra Modi gave it a try when he tried to establish mandatory voting in the municipal elections, but one look at the criticism of it and you will know how we all thrive in our collective lack of accountability.
So, yes, kuchh farak nehi padega. One dynasty would come and go, another dynasty would stand in it’s place. Until the idea of democracy can be imbibed into a new generation through necessity and education, we would continue to project ourselves as the grand democracy that was never there.
All – i think we have to take the ground situation into consideration before condeming the Indian public. Agree that we are apathetic to any social causes.. including dirty by-lanes where gargabe is strewn all over without any sense of cleanliness. This attitude just extends to the entire gamut of issues that dog this country. However, consider this situation: People have to live in a situation where (a) judiciary is corrupt – you cannot get justice in courts(b) police is corrupt (c) there is no serious protection offered by police to general public (d) no social security safety net, meaning people have to fend for themselves even after retirement age (e) pathetic medical situation in government hospitals (f) with several quotas going around, private eduction is the only recourse for the masses (g) people encounter fraud in each and every situation, especially in major matters like purchase of property etc (h) women cannot travel freely in late evenings… even rapits get away (i) countless murderers and thugs being released in bail and living in the society (j) highest road accident rates (k) overseas money pouring in to change the demography of the country (l) acharyas that are reverred are systematically targeted by the government, aided by the money-hungry media (m)honest tax payers having to compete with corrupt people to uplife their standard of living (where only corrupt people would succeed (n) public voting on caste lines rather than real issues (o) pople not caring about elections for the above reasons (and the ones that care vote on caste lines). Highest fuel prices in all of SE Asia, Highest inflation eating up money of fixed income earners. The list could go on. I am only trying to project the list of problems common man faces in this country. In such a situation, apathy towards social causes is to be expected. To write simply, people have lost faith in the present government and in all the governments that could be formed in the future. Therefore, everyone is just taking care of themselves. Because, government treats its people like dirt. This is a vicious circle, but I dont think middle-class is going to take the lead. i dont want ot sound like a pessimist here, when people with so much of optimism visit this site. But, I just to write about the ground situation. With efforts of people like Shantanu and countless other activits on the web, the change will come, but the reality faced by the common man will be a great impediment to bring about involvement of common man into social causes.
@sid – Good observation and I salute your mention of the tireless Indian worker.
Democracy is just one political system. It has many shortcomings in general. In India, it works a little less than it does in the West. Still, it managed to throw the government that committed excesses in 1974 emergency rule. It managed to throw out the farcical Janata clones and clans, and it managed to oust BJP.
But that is not the main problem, nor the main solution. The main problem is Indian intellegentsia. You can see here that guys want aam aadami to take the trouble to go out to India gate and protest
– an act that will almost never produce any farak. They(Indian intellegentsia) feel great when they blame the aam aadami for not responding.
Fortunately, Indian aam aadami is smart. S/He spends whatever little spare time in watching movies and singing songs and watching cricket – a praiseworthy activity. The political activists don’t like it.. but so what?
Watching movies and seeing cricket in above comment reminds me:
Some where I heard that years back delegations from another country came to India and when they were returning back to their country they had been asked for their suggestions and what they felt about India. In humorous tone they said; they have noticed that Indian people are very spiritual, believes in God, goes to temple and prays to God. Seeing the politicians of India we recommend them to keep continue going to temple and praying to God, only because of this they have survived so far and will survive in future.
Madhusudan, Sanjay, Sid, Sat, filtered and Indian: Thanks for sharing your thoughts…Have been tied up at work…will respond over the weekend.
@ Madhusudan (#11): Agree whole-heartedly: “All of us who have internet connection at their home can start writing over such issues. and can start blogs/ connect people to existing blogs. and bring a change in the mindsets of those whom we influence. In our cirle we can spread the word…A nationalist sentiment has to be awakened in all. Remember, not a single communist came to Bengal to propogate his ideology. It was their literature that did us in. The blogs are our books in this information age.”
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@Sanjay: Indeed. Arvind’s efforts are praiseworthy and far more than most of us have done.
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@Usse: While I agree that “there is no such place on earth that is free of corrupt politicians”, in most developed democracies, this group is in a minority unlike in India. Human nature means that one cannot eliminate corruption but one can design systems to detect it and take remedial action. No one here is pretending that they/their group will be immune to corruption…The important thing is to have mechanisms to detect abuse of power/ positions of power rather than pretend to be a saint.
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@Madhusudan (#15): I applaud your efforts to spread awareness about these issues. As you rightly said, “Farak toh padta hai bhai.” Thank you, really.
Thanks for the links. I will have a look at them. I am curious to read more about the “Working Villages International”
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@ Sid (#16): I found your comment thought-provoking particularly the bit about …there is indifference towards democracy..(because) the current democratic system never found cultural root in our country or society“…I am in two minds here…Agreed that we never had regular “elections” in the centuries gone by..on the other hand, we have had at least three generations that have grown up in a democracy – is that not enough to change the mind-set? I do not know..What do others think?
I agree with you that “the idea of democracy” needs to be “imbibed into a new generation through necessity and education”. So perhaps there is an issue of creating awareness here – which I think is the crux of the matter.
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@Sat: No, I am not condemning the Indian public. I have the highest regard for the real “aam aadmi” who struggles to make a living and to keep the family in comfort. I reserve my contempt for those who have earned their money, their status and their position in society; have enough left for their offsprings and yet are running after a few dollars more.
The challanges you have cited do not exist for such people because they have effectively created an alternative “reality” in which they live…
So while I agree that the common man/woman faces a herculean task in challenging the “system”, the same cannot be said about the ones who have been fortunate (and I count myself amongst the fortunate). It is OUR duty to do something about this rather than planning for the next vacation or the next property investment…
It is hard (and possibly unfair to expect) the “middle-class” to take the lead…but what ahout the so-called “Upper Middle-class” and what about the genuinely wealthy?
Change will come but it will be a long and hard journey…I keep reminding everyone in my talks and meetings that we should drop any pretence of being able to change India in 5-10 years. This will likely take a generation…but we have to begin somewhere. Giving up is seriously not an option.
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@filtered: You hit the nail on the head. “The main problem is Indian intellegentsia…They(Indian intellegentsia) feel great when they blame the aam aadami for not responding” I would not put Arvind in that category though. He has shown what can be accomplished by single-minded determination.
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@Indian: “Seeing the politicians of India we recommend them to keep continue going to temple and praying to God, only because of this they have survived so far and will survive in future.” Thats funny!
B Shantanu – You said – Human nature means that one cannot eliminate corruption but one can design systems to detect it and take remedial action.
That would be a good beginning. It also means that all finger pointing should stop. A typical Indian politician is no worse than a typical Western politician. Compare a typical Indian farmer with a US farmer. One uses manual labour so has his hands and clothes dirtied. Other uses machinery so appears clean. Or the Indian aam aadmi to a Western aam aadmi. One moves on dusty roads and dirty carriages. The other, on clean roads and gas-guzzling big cars. A typical Indian will end up being smelly after a day’s work. So also the Indian politician who seems corrupt, but is merely a slave of the situation around.
Let us move on to systems. Who designs them? How can one influence that design? Can a group do it better? Will it help if all finger-pointing is prevented by rule? Does everyone need to follow self-discipline in order to change the system? Is the old socialist model of morcha-gherao-shout still the best model to use? Is one’s time best used by participating in such demonstrations or have politicians got used to managing such sporadic unrest?
In short, one must thing out of the box to be able to make a difference!
@Shantanu,
… on the other hand, we have had at least three generations that have grown up in a democracy – is that not enough to change the mind-set?
You have to see the kind of elections these generations saw. Each election brings in more dirt and filth than the previous ones. And each one had less percentage of votes in successive elections ( http://www.indian-elections.com/india-statistics.html ,from 1984 to 2004 barring 1998, not sure about the authenticity of the statistics though).
When we say the word “election”, what is the image that comes in our mind? In my mind, it plays thus: 2 hours of wait under the sun in a hot & humid day (why it always have to be in summer is a question worth asking), reaching the poll and knowing that some one already took care of it (I could vote only twice, in 1998 & 2004). Is it the same image you want to draw when you would teach your children about the importance of election? In most cases, parents do not have to, children knew and made their concepts about democracy.
The solution to corruption and good democracy is same: corruption (economic and legal), disobeying the laws (even not buying ticket in railways) and over-zealous bureaucracy must be made a social taboo. For example, why do not anybody move naked in the streets? Because this is a social taboo to do so. Similarly, bad democratic practices can be largely countered if they are considered taboo. Otherwise, no amount of enforcement is going to work since tools of enforcement is under the spell of the disease. I am not saying that if it is possible, power manipulation would not happen but it can be eliminated mostly, at least at the ground level.
I liked this a lot, Sid: “…corruption (economic and legal), disobeying the laws (even not buying ticket in railways) and over-zealous bureaucracy must be made a social taboo. For example, why do not anybody move naked in the streets? Because this is a social taboo to do so. Similarly, bad democratic practices can be largely countered if they are considered taboo.“..
If you don’t mind, I would like to use this line of reasoning (and example) in my talks…
Thanks
Shantanu,
No problem. This is a public forum, you are free to pick up any of the reasoning here.