|| Satyameva Jayate ||

Dedicated to “Bharat” and “Dharma”

Open Thread on Conversions, Christianity, Islam etc.

Dear All: I am opening this thread to provide a place to discuss all aspects related to Conversions, Christianity, Islam etc.

Please be sensitive in your comments. No personal abuse please. I will be deleting and editing comments that I feel have crossed the line. If you feel I have overlooked something, please alert me by leaving a comment here. Have a good discussion.

For those of you who may be new here, please have a look at my comments policy (and a shorter version here). If you do not wish to leave your email id on the site, use satyacomment@gmail.com

The last few comments from the RSS thread are reproduced below to help continue the discussion. Thanks.

*** Comments Begin (30th Dec onwards) ***

Comment by Aman:

Ashok:
1. In that case sir, I must quote to you what Gandhiji once told a fan of the Gita who was denouncing the Bible & wanting to convert.

Gandhiji thought a while and said: ‘I think you have not understood the Bible well. Since you are not a good Christian, how can you be a good Hindu?

It is therefore better that you first become a good Christian. If you succeed in doing this, you will become a good human being. And if you do so, then you will not only be a good Christian, but a good Hindu, a good Muslim and a good Jew as well. The walls of narrow, separate religions within your heart will then break away.’

This shows Gandhiji’s understanding of true religion, unity of all religions and his broad-mindedness.

***

Comment by Ashok:

Aman!!! It seems you are a full time paid propagandist for the holy church. I did not say I did not have time for this blog. I have less stime for meandering meandering logic like that of yours. I have some short takes for you.

If all relegion are equal ( as you benignly declare in contravention to the laid down core values of monolithic religions like christianity- thanks for that) then what is the meaning in cruel rituals like conversion. Why convert??/ Why Why Why??

Why cant the gospel of christ be taught alongside teaching of Krishna. To teach someone the Gospel why should you try and erase the teachings of Krishna

And you have quoted something from Gandhi. I dont know if he said that. He was too shrewd a politician and I wont be surprised if he said a thing like that. But he also said something to the effect that conversion is cruel; you wont have heard that ofcourse since you select history selectively.

And I want to ask you now; Aman!! have you read Bible?? And have you reflected on it or you have blindly beleived what ever your convertor has told you. If you read and reflect on each line and try and peep into the mind or most probable hired minds which have produced this document, you will be horrified

And I am really amused at your allusion that Hindu religion has something to do with narrowness of mind and wall and all that. A christian cannot even declare that people worshipping different Gods can reach heaven. The reall narrowness is here; right inside the Bible dear brother and you blame the most open religion of narrownes. Forgive him God for he does not know what he is saying.

I forgive you

***

Comment by Aman:

ashok:

So you aren’t a man of your word. :-)
Not surprising, considering the jokers you look up to are two faced themselves.

Anyway… here are some short takes for you.

– I don’t do propaganda. That will explain partly what I have against the rss.

– Conversion is a personal choice. Heard of free will? Nobody needs religion (or conversion) to find God, but some people believe it does. To each his own.

– It can be. It is in places. Knowledge is available all over. I was taught about Rama, Christ, Krishna, Buddha, Mahavir, Kabir, Nanak, Moses & Muhammed. I guess I was lucky. Today if I encounter someone trying to influence my views, I change their funda. :-)

– I am aware that you don’t know whether Gandhi said that. Which is why I told you! :-)
To you Gandhi was a shrewd politician. To Tagore, he was a Mahatma.
He was against conversion or overt evangelism yes, but I don’t recall him calling it cruel.
If you think it is cruel, talk to the rss about their ghar-vapasi programme & lakshmiananda’s followers.

– I suggest you read the Bible when you’re not on lsd. Which line are you referring to as specifically horrifying? :-)

– Where exactly is it implied that the religion commonly referred to as Hinduism is narrow minded??? Your comprehension is a problem. Which explains your views on everything.

***

Comment by Kaffir:

“- Conversion is a personal choice. Heard of free will? Nobody needs religion (or conversion) to find God, but some people believe it does. To each his own”

Wow, so all your hot passion turns into ice when it comes to conversion and calling a spade a spade? Conversion = intolerance of others, not accepting others as they are and they need to be like me. Tolerating such intolerance is not a virtue, more so after knowing that this belief of converting others has been historically used to kill and plunder others and destroy their cultures.

BTW, why not apply “free will” to many of your criticisms?

“I suggest you read the Bible when you’re not on lsd. Which line are you referring to as specifically horrifying?”

Leviticus 18 and 20, for example.

***

Comment by Aman:

kaffir…

My fire is reserved for things I can see wrong with. Does it work any other way?

If I see injustice, I will breathe fire. If I see conversion at gunpoint or knifepoint, I will cry foul. If I see societal corecion at work in conversions, I will cry foul. If I see economic incentives at work, I will disapprove. But I will not decry someone trying to spread their message. If someone comes to me believing that it is in human interest to spread the message of Krishna/Buddha/Moses/Christ/Muhammed, I will not stop them. There is good in those messages.
Ashoka sent evangelists all over India. His children Sanghamitra & Mahinda were evangelists that spread Buddishm to Sri Lanka.
Adi Shankaracharya travelled all over India attempting & effecting a revival of the ancient Vedic faith.
Dayananda Saraswati not only evangelised but also actively converted & reconverted into the revivalist Arya Samaj fold.

Vivekananda did the same but he was probably more apologist then revivalist. He was also an evangelist.

Why should I object?

Conversion is not = to intolerance. Conversion is preaching & finding acceptance for one’s ideas. You can evangelize religious philosophy, economic theory, forms of Govt., Gavaskar’s greatness, anything you feel like. And if people come round to your point of view, there’s no harm really. If you have a compelling enough argument why not? In fact often it is important to get people to think differently. For example, those who claim that Border was greater than Gavaskar need to be spoken to! If they don’t listen, that is up to their free will.

And just because you use a sword do kill doesn’t mean steel is evil. Similarly if people use religion of evangelising it for evil purposes doesn’t mean that they’re evil. Those who use them for bad purposes are bad! And no culture has really been destroyed by conversion. There are a lot of factors at play. I wonder what happened to the ancient Harrappan culture…?

Once you understand the ancient history of conversions in India, you’ll be a little more tolerant of conversions today I guess. For example, how did ancient tribal customs give way to the Vedic way of life? How did their ancient gods get replaced by Hindu gods? Did this have royal patronage as well? Read up a little, think about it a little. Come back. I’m certain you will chase me around the web a little while longer.

As for applying free will to my criticisms, I’m not sure what you mean; but if you mean why do I not let things & people be, then you don’t understand free will. Free will means having the freedom to choose. The freedom to express & the freedom to argue I guess. I don’t force anyone to follow my path. I exercise my freedom to express my views. And even that I am doing lesser & lesser of. Partly out of respect for free will of course. One can only take the horse to the water; one can’t make him drink. :-)

And what is so horrifying about Leviticus 18 & 20?

***

Comment by Rohit:

My fire is reserved for things I can see wrong with.

Here are some of the places where you can gospel: SWAT, FATA, KASHMIR, UIGHUR… I am sure you will get rousing reception.

Free Will… Why should I object?

The other way around is also free will; i.e., opposing mullahs and baptistos so go and talk to your mullas and baptistos, especially mulla omar who is in your lovely Pakistan or Afghanistan… Border is porous and you can meet him easily… Take Zakir Naik also along with yourself.

Once you understand the ancient history of conversions in India, you’ll be a little more tolerant of conversions today I guess. For example, how did ancient tribal customs give way to the Vedic way of life? How did their ancient gods get replaced by Hindu gods? Did this have royal patronage as well? Read up a little, think about it a little.

You think and research about the conversions about gulf and the nomads and their limited gibberishes. Why they copied the same stuff again and again… It will be more fruitful. And also think why no non muslim or non christian was left where ever the good sword people went with cheap copies of Judaism.

***

Comment by Ashok:

Thank God you( a Gandhian as you call yourself) accepted atleast one thing that your own ideal was against conversion.

What do I find horrifying in Bible?? It will take volumes and annoy the blog owner. Please google and read ‘ proving bible is repulsvie’ on the net. There is great dea of information on it from western source;not from the RSS. I am sure you will find some more queer logic to circumvent this information andt the logic

And who told you I will not vis this site. You by logic tried to impose it on me. It was your wish not mine. I do not know who has a comprehension problem. And calling me not a man of my word ; a word which I have not given. Queer.

Reading your post remind me how the church trapped and tormented Copernicus merely for saying that the earth is round and is not the centre of the universe. you must read about this too; the formal case by the church against Copernicus and how he was brought to his knees by the church

If you have read bible and find nothing repulsive in it I am really amazed. How can people tell lies not only to others but to themselve. Shall get back with the data later

***

Pl. continue to share your thoughts below.

Related Posts:

Why have Missionaries chosen to attack India?

“Why are Christian Missions targetting India?” – II

Why are Christian Missionaries targeting India – III

On Kandhamal, Conversions and Proselytization (Part IV)

Why are Christian Missionaries Targeting India – V

December 31st, 2009 Posted by | Conversions, Missionaries in India, Debates & Discussions | 90 comments

90 Comments »

  1. Dear All: Further to my comment @ #46, the discussion on this thread is now closed.

    For a glimpse into the earlier discussions (spanning 500+ comments), pl. see the links to “Related Posts” just above the first comment.

    In addition, you may wish to read some of the posts in this category Conversions, Missionaries in India.

    Comment by B Shantanu | January 21, 2010

  2. Re-opening the thread temporarily to post this news-report:

    From Child traffickers from North-East set up base in Tamil Nadu by Arun Ram, TNN, 26 January 2010, 03:58am IST (emphasis added)

    CHENNAI: Hundreds of children from the northeastern states are being trafficked by well-networked groups, who have found a safe haven in Tamil Nadu. The rescue of 76 malnourished children, from Manipur and Assam, from a home at Kuzhithurai in Kanyakumari district this week is only the tip of a vast network, which receives crores of rupees from churches and agencies abroad by showing a large number of children under their “care”.

    Children from Manipur, especially those belonging to the Kuki tribe, are targeted by traffickers masquerading as evangelists and missionaries as people in the insurgency-hit areas are willing to send off their children if they are promised a good education.

    The children aged six to 15 are kept in pathetic conditions and are often made to do jobs like carpentry, cooking and laundry. There have even been cases of children dying under suspicious circumstances and some being molested and abused.

    Incidentally, a majority of homes charged with trafficking are run by missionaries or evangelical societies. “These institutions exploit religion to make money. With many of them not registered with the government, the homes escape scrutiny,” says Vidya Reddy of Tulir, Centre for Prevention and Healing of Child Sexual Abuse.

    Comment by B Shantanu | January 26, 2010

  3. A brief excerpt from an ExpressBuzz report: On charges of conversions by Christians, the commission said that there were indications of massive conversions to Christianity by circumstances and inducements, but not by compulsion.

    Comment by B Shantanu | February 2, 2010

  4. Source: From http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/28/opinion/28kristof.html

    A pop quiz: What’s the largest U.S.-based international relief and development organization?

    It’s not Save the Children, and it’s not CARE — both terrific secular organizations. Rather, it’s World Vision, a Seattle-based Christian organization (with strong evangelical roots) whose budget has roughly tripled over the last decade.

    World Vision now has 40,000 staff members in nearly 100 countries. That’s more staff members than CARE, Save the Children and the worldwide operations of the United States Agency for International Development — combined.

    Comment by B Shantanu | February 28, 2010

  5. Christian agent is out again. Please sign this petition http://www.petitiononline.com/dharma10/

    If you are in the New York region don’t forget to participate in USHA protest against this pervert!

    http://www.ushaonline.org/Downloads/PROTEST_MARCH_FLIER.pdf

    Comment by VoP | March 8, 2010

  6. Prof Ramdas Lamb’s article in Washington Post is a good one.

    An interesting extract from the article below

    “In early 2009, Pope Benedict XVI met the Chief Rabbinate of Israel and agreed to stop all conversion attempts directed at Jews. A month later, Cardinal Jean-Louis Pierre Tauran, president of Vatican’s Pontifical Council for Inter-religious Dialogue, visited India and was asked while there if he would offer Hindus the same respect. He refused. There is a degree to narrow mindedness in every religious tradition, but when that is coupled with fundamentalist arrogance and powerful backing, nothing good can come from it”

    http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/panelists/ramdas_lamb/2010/03/missionaries_the_good_the_bad_and_the_ugly.html

    Please read the article from the above web site and there are many more written by Prof Ramdas Lamb . Just google
    The Faith Panelists section in Washington Post has very good articles.

    Comment by gajanan | March 26, 2010

  7. Hi Shantanu and others,

    Pardon me, if I am writing out of context here.

    I am trying to enquire the credentials of a charitiable organization called “Divine Light Trust”, Whitefield, Bangalore, India. Its trail lead me to its sponsor called ROSE VZW, based in Belgium.

    Does anybody in this group know, if its a missionary organisation?

    The reason: my niece got an interview call for recruitment in this org, as she is a candidate specialized in teaching children with learning disabilities.

    I do not want her to join an institution that has anything to do with missionary organisations.

    Any information on this is appreciated.

    Thanks in advance…
    RV

    Comment by ravindranath | April 24, 2010

  8. RV: A 10-minute google search unearthed the following information.

    ***

    From a comment on a blog:
    ROSE vzw is a volunteer organization based in Leuven, Belgium with the objective of giving a helping hand to less-privileged children in rural India. ROSE was established in 2001 as a VZW organization (Registration Nr 0474.242.896) with this objective. It should be noted that this organization was started and is being run by the Masters/PhD/Postdoc students from Katholieke Universiteit Leuven, Belgium.

    One of the projects funded by Rose is St Anthony Balwadi, Ternamaki in Karnataka.

    From the website of the Katholieke Universiteit Leuven:

    As a Catholic university, K.U.Leuven is a critical centre of thought within the Catholic community. As such, it is deeply concerned with the relationship between science and faith and with the dialogue between the church and the world.

    also:

    Founded in 1425 by Pope Martin V, K.U.Leuven bears the double honour of being the oldest existant Catholic university in the world…

    ***
    Can readers who may be familiar with the organisation pl. share their views?
    If you unearth something new, please feel free to post it here (with links and references). Thanks.

    Comment by B Shantanu | April 24, 2010

  9. Some info on the Divine Light Trust:

    From a pdf report:

    Similarly, the Jesuit-run Divine Light Trust for the Blind near Bangalore has become a resource centre to train teachers in mainstream schools in order to encourage the inclusion of blind children in their classrooms (Coleridge, 1993).

    From the website of one of the Trust’s donors, St Vincent’s Church:
    Divine Light Trust for the Blind send their sincere thanks for the donation of £1100 and for your kind generosity and support

    From another page on the St Vincent Church’s website:

    Committed to do more than talk about faith, Frederic, with a small group of friends, formed the first “Conference of Charity,” which met weekly to contribute to a secret collection and then visit the poor in their homes. Today, the worldwide St. Vincent de Paul Society continues this type of quiet service through its almost one million members. The Society of St Vincent de Paul, or SSVP, is a worldwide confederation of national charities with nearly one million members. Membership is open to men and women, young and old. The SSVP asks that members accept fully the Christian ethos of the SSVP, and are committed to express their love of God through personal service to their neighbour.

    ***

    Presume that the Divine Light Trust you have mentioned in your message is the same one I am talking about.

    Comment by B Shantanu | April 24, 2010

  10. With respect to a link in the incoming post (http://satyameva-jayate.org/2009/10/18/missionaries-targeting-india-5/), the comments made in the article on the external site (http://in.christiantoday.com/articles/view-enlightening-our-hearts-this-diwali/4646.htm) are dripping with hypocrisy.

    On one hand the commenter’s wish happy Diwali. On the other hand, they can’t help but express their exclusivity by claiming their faith to be the ONLY truth and answer. Such supremacist bigotry is the root cause of conflicts plaguing the human species. Fundamentally, there is no difference between them and the likes of Taliban. The only difference is that while Osama-bin-Laden and his ilk are aggressive and upfront about their totalitarian bigoted ethos, the “holier-than-thou” supremacists mask that under a veneer of subtlety, finesse and shameless hypocrisy!

    Comment by Manas | June 7, 2010

  11. Survival of the fittest is the law which governs the animal nature prevalent in western culture.

    CONVERSION – IS PERVERSION
    CONVERSION – IS GROSS VIOLENCE
    CONVERSION – IS ERROSION OF CULTURE
    CONVERSION – IS AGGRESSION
    CONVERSION – IS INTRUSION IN ONES PRIVACY
    CONVERSION – IS DIVISION
    CONVERSION – IS INVASION
    CONVERSION – IS DESTRUCTION OF RELIGIOUS HARMONY
    CONVERSION – IS DOMINATION OF LAND AND PEOPLE
    CONVERSION – IS TERRORISM

    BAN CONVERSION AND SAVE THE NATION

    Comment by vedamgopal | August 10, 2010

  12. =>
    “Survival of the fittest is the law which governs the animal nature prevalent in western culture. “
    =>

    Yet in a forest, one would find animals like deer and rabbits (not so fit – according to your theory) as well as lions and tigers (fittest), who prey on the former. Survival of the fittest doesn’t imply that the fittest animals (like lion) get rid of, and exterminate the not-so-fittest animals (like deer) – they only take as much is required for their food. Your example seems to me yet another instance of the misuse of the cliché “survival of the fittest” – which is thrown around without much understanding – to explain human behavior.

    Comment by Kaffir | August 10, 2010

  13. Additionally:
    In nature, “survival of the fittest” happens over generations because of genetic variations, and is not a conscious process. (i.e. A lion doesn’t say, “Oh, I’m the fittest and strongest, so let me go out and kill all the other not-so-fit animals.”)

    Comment by Kaffir | August 10, 2010

  14. Take a look here. Now they need a private militia …

    http://www.hindustantimes.com/News-Feed/orissa/Christians-may-form-militia-for-protection/Article1-334915.aspx

    Comment by Sid | September 1, 2010

  15. They did not feel lost so they felt no need to be saved….

    courtesy Atanu Dey. Pl take 10mins to watch this video.

    Comment by B Shantanu | September 6, 2010

  16. Please see this article today from TIME:

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20101208/wl_time/08599203586200

    White Christians openly use derogatory, racist word “Tigan” (Untouchable) to call Hindu-origin Roma (Gypsies), just like they still use “Nigger” for Black/African-origin people.

    And the same White Christian supremacists use cooked-up “untouchability” propaganda as an excuse to justify converting poor Hindus in India.

    Comment by Defiance | December 10, 2010

  17. @Definance,
    Why would not they? Gypsies or Roma people have a strong Indian origin who ran to eastern Europe to save themselves from Islamic prosecution. More than thousand years passed and European society still have not learned how to assimilate them, but they have learned how to chair various human rights commission so that they can lecture the “third world” on human rights.

    Comment by Sid | December 10, 2010

  18. and now Telangana for Christ
    http://indianrealist.wordpress.com/2010/12/26/telangana-for-christ/

    K Chandrasekhara Rao said that Christians will get their due rights only in the new state. “I have alloted 25 lakhs for building a church in Mahboobnagar, and will be spending similarly every year,” he said. “When the Telangana state is formed, I undertake to build churches with government money. There will always be one slot reserved for Christians in the state cabinet.”

    Comment by VoP | December 26, 2010

  19. Somasekhara Comm finds BJP, Sangh not respnsble 4 church attacks in Karnataka (2008). Derogatory literature & issue of conversion main reasons. http://bit.ly/hn1yuj

    Comment by B Shantanu | January 28, 2011

  20. Conversion lobby is going too far with their diabolical agenda. Consider the struggle that Sadhvi Pragya is going through without any credible proof against her. Now Swamy Aseemananda is the next victim. Whether he is really culprit or not is a matter for court to decide. Unlike the crowd that worships Binayak Sen, we are not preposterous enough to suggest that he should be released without trial before the courts. But please sign this petition to ensure that there is justice to both likes of Aseemananda and the victims of the terror which he has been alleged to commit. We do not want to repeat the things that happened with Sadhvi Pragya, do we?

    Comment by thinking_hard | February 19, 2011

  21. Two news-reports from today:

    From a report in The Hindu titled, “186500: Vatican official on India-Pakistan conflict and Indian approach to religious freedom”:

    2. (C) Elaborating on religious freedom issues in India, Murphy said a victory for Hindu Nationalist party BJP in India’s general elections next May probably would not be good for the Catholic Church. The BJP has favored anti-conversion laws on the books in five Indian states. These are of concern to the Vatican, even if they are not being applied, because they create a hostile environment to religious freedom and discourage the conversion of Dalits in particular.

    ****

    From a report titled, The world is coming to an end, so follow us to Bethlehem by Ram Parmar in Mumbai, posted On Sunday, April 24, 2011 at 04:39:39 PM:
    ..Five priests from Vasai converted hundreds of tribals from Devkhop village near Palghar to Christianity, saying the world will come to an end in 2012, and only those living in Bethlehem Jesus Christ’s birthplace will survive.

    The tribals’ families stoned the bus sent by the priests for the converts

    William Dias, Santa D’Souza, Alphonso Dabre, Simon John D’Souza and Solomon Shinde, all parish priests, were arrested on Thursday from Devkhop, around 11 km from Mumbai.

    They told the tribals who had converged in the village that within a matter of minutes, they would vanish, only to reappear in Bethlehem, Israel.

    Families of the tribals alerted the police, and the priests, along with their aide Hari Wadhan, were arrested.

    Police said preliminary investiga-tions revealed the tribals were misled to ensure they convert to Christianity, and the priests didn’t take any money from them. However, many tribals sold their lands and cattle, thinking those would be of no use in Bethlehem.

    Palghar resident Ashok Bhole, who along with activist Parag Gharat accompanied the tribals’ families to the police station, said the priests were “brainwashing” the tribals for the past 10 days.

    “These are poor people, many of whom have not stepped out of their village in decades. They were promised trips to a foreign land (Bethlehem) and cash,” he said.

    Comment by B Shantanu | April 25, 2011

  22. yes this is going on in suburbs of Mumbai. Posters on railway stations near the ticket counters.
    Pictures of apocalypse, tsunami, jesus christ. My question is why are the christians indulging in such cheap tactics to induce people to embrace christianity?

    Weird, Apocalypse, eh!

    Comment by Madhusudan | April 26, 2011

  23. Putting this here for the record..From a BBC report from more than 11 years ago: ‘Church backing Tripura rebels’, Tuesday, 18 April, 2000, 10:11 GMT 11:11 UK

    By Subir Bhaumik in Calcutta
    The government in India’s north-eastern state of Tripura says it has evidence that the state’s Baptist Church is involved in backing separatist rebels.

    Tripura Chief Minister Manik Sarkar said state police had uncovered details of the alleged link after questioning a church leader.

    Nagmanlal Halam, secretary of the Noapara Baptist Church in Tripura, was arrested late on Monday with a large quantity of explosives.

    Mr Sarkar said that allegations about the close links between the state’s Baptist Church and the rebel National Liberation Front of Tripura (NLFT) have long been made by political parties and police.

    Now for the first time, he said, hard evidence supporting the allegations had been found.

    The NLFT is accused of forcing Tripura’s indigenous tribes to become Christians and give up Hindu forms of worship in areas under their control.
    Last year, they issued a ban on the Hindu festivals of Durga Puja and Saraswati Puja.
    The NLFT manifesto says that they want to expand what they describe as the kingdom of God and Christ in Tripura.

    Comment by B Shantanu | May 15, 2011

  24. could not stop myself but to share this joke.

    Each Friday night after work, Sardar would fire up his outdoor grill and
    cook a tandoori chicken and some meat kebabs. But, all of his neighbors
    were strict Catholics … and since it was Lent, they were forbidden
    from eating chicken and meat on a Friday.

    The delicious aroma
    from the grilled meats was causing such a problem for the Catholic
    faithful that they finally talked to their Priest. The Priest came to
    visit Sardar and suggested that he become a Catholic. After several
    classes and much study, Sardar attended Mass… and as the priest
    sprinkled holy water over him, he said, You were born a Sikh, and raised
    a Sikh, but now, you are a Catholic.”

    Sardar’s neighbors were
    greatly relieved, until Friday night arrived. The wonderful aroma of
    tandoori chicken and meat kebabs filled the neighborhood. The Priest was
    called immediately by the neighbors and, as he rushed into Sardar’s
    backyard, clutching a rosary and prepared to scold him, he stopped and
    watched in amazement.

    There stood Sardar, holding a small bottle
    of holy water which he carefully sprinkled over the grilling meats and
    chanted: “Oye, you were born a chicken, and you were born a lamb, you
    were raised a chicken and you were raised a lamb but now you are a
    potato and tomato”

    After all, –Singh is King

    Comment by shyam | May 24, 2011

  25. The Role of Evangelicals in U.S. Imperialism
    by Iain Buchanan.

    Comment by B Shantanu | May 30, 2011

  26. Interesting:
    Christians welcome Supreme Court order on Salwa Judum, Published Date: July 6, 2011:
    Christians have welcomed the Supreme Court’s order to disband Salwa Judum, an armed civilian vigilante group formed to fight Maoist insurgency in Chhattisgarh.

    Pl read in context of comment #73 above.

    Comment by B Shantanu | July 7, 2011

  27. From Case filed against religious conversion in Kashmir:
    Police registered a case on Saturday on the basis of allegations that Christian missionaries in Kashmir were encouraging conversions. It is likely to arrest a pastor whose name figured in a complaint lodged before the Grand Mufti of Kashmir.

    Keeping in view the sensitivity of the issue, the Srinagar police registered an FIR under sections 153-A, 295 and 186 of the Ranbir Penal Code. The decision was taken at the highest level to avoid possible unrest in the Valley.

    “We have registered a case and we are looking into a CD which has been given to us in support of the allegations made about the conversion,” a senior police officer told The Hindu on condition of anonymity. However, no one had been named in the FIR. That would be done after the investigation was completed and the allegations were prima facie established.

    Comment by B Shantanu | October 30, 2011

  28. Placing these translations by Sudhir Kumar here for the record:
    Andhra Jyothy is the third largest circulated newspaper in Andhra Pradesh. From November 10 to 16th, the newspaper ran a six-part series on religious conversions in AP. The following is a translation of their articles. No personal views have been recorded in any of the six parts below. Part 3 original was published here. (Part 1, Part 2)

    Part 1: http://centreright.in/2011/11/andhra-jyothy-proselytizing-unlimited/1/

    Part 2: http://centreright.in/2011/11/andhra-jyothy-proselytizing-unlimited/2/

    Part 3: “Andhra Jyothy : Proselytizing Unlimited!”
    http://centreright.in/2011/11/andhra-jyothy-proselytizing-unlimited/3/#.TtSUX7JzMQx

    Comment by B Shantanu | November 29, 2011

  29. Somewhat related (via Radha Rajan-ji; emphasis added):

    http://www.hydromissions.com/links.htm

    Hydromissions International is all about Jesus Christ – we have no desire to become just another humanitarian relief organization. If you would like to be added to this page, please contact us. The following links are all organizations and individuals whose primary objective is to share the love of Christ through water ministry. Please support them as they faithfully serve Him.

    http://www.hydromissions.com/asia.htm#india
    In March, 2009, Hydromissions founders, Steve and Jennifer Lorch flew to the town of Tuni in the State of Andra Pradesh to work with CCIMA Mission. Together, a well was put into a coastal area using a local sand drilling technique. This well gave local Christians the open door to construct a church gathering place which had formerly been denied (for several years) by the village leaders. This “foot in the door” is a great move forward in sharing the gospel with an unreached area, and it is the hope of CCIMA to continue this type of outreach to many more villages annually.

    Comment by B Shantanu | January 2, 2012

  30. Adding this here for the record: State has no right to meddle in conversion cases: HC, 3 September 2012:
    A new controversy is set to dog religious conversion and re-conversion with the Himachal Pradesh High Court ruling that changing religion is a matter of one’s personal belief and the State has no role to know whether it is a forced or free conversion.

    If upheld by the Supreme Court, this order delivered on Thursday last, can have widespread ramifications on the raging debate on conversions and pave the way for people to change their religion at will without requiring them to give prior mandatory intimation to the local District Magistrate.

    Holding that the Act was contrary to the right to practice any religion and the right to privacy linked to Article 21 of the Constitution, the bench of Justices Deepak Gupta and Rajiv Sharma held on Thursday, “A person’s belief or religion is something very personal to him. The State has no right to ask a person to disclose what his personal belief is.”

    The decision is expected to be challenged before the Supreme Court owing to its impact on the State’s effort to curb forced conversions.

    Comment by B Shantanu | September 4, 2012

  31. An example of the unholy nexus between evangelization, corruption, a 2000acres land grant & Congress http://j.mp/YvcDQR

    From YSR family comes under helicopter cloud By A SRINIVASA RAO, 18 February 2013

    The tremors of the VVIP helicopter scam were felt in Andhra Pradesh after the spotlight fell on the family of the late former chief minister Y.S. Rajasekhara Reddy and his evangelist son-in-law Anil Kumar.

    Carlo Gerosa, the business partner of controversial arms agent Guido Haschke and allegedly a middleman in the multi-crore scam that helped AgustaWestland clinch the deal to sell 12 helicopters to the Indian Air Force, was associated with Arbor Charitable Foundation India – a Christian missionary and service organisation based at Karunagiri of Naidupet block in Khammam district.

    Sources said Arbor began its fully-fledged activities after the organisers got in touch with then chief minister YSR Reddy in 2007…

    Read it in full…

    Comment by B Shantanu | February 28, 2013

  32. Adding this well-referenced article here for the record: EVANGELIST MODUS OPERANDI IN INDIA: A REPORT

    Comment by B Shantanu | April 22, 2014

  33. Placing these 2 links with extensive references and documentation here:

    http://sighbaboo.blogspot.in/

    and https://twitter.com/sighbaboo/media

    Comment by B Shantanu | June 7, 2014

  34. “Bro Bakht Singh” – who “launched an indigenous church-planting movement in India that eventually saw more than 10,000 local churches planted throughout India, Pakistan and offshore Sri Lanka.http://j.mp/VXaamK
    The last sentence is telling: “No foreigner was visible (at his memorial service) so as not to lend credence to the false rumor that Christianity is a foreign religion.
    Courtesy Sanjay.

    Comment by B Shantanu | August 30, 2014

  35. Superb fact-based research by Shiva Kumaran over at IndiaFacts.co.in: Gospel for Asia and its Indian connections

    Comment by B Shantanu | September 8, 2014

  36. Posting this link here for the record: Is religious conversion really a fundamental right, or can we ban it? by Jaideep A Prabhu, Sep 8, 2014.
    My quick thoughts (following a hurried read): Makes some interesting points. I felt the distinction (and the nuance) between voluntary conversion and conversion that has its roots in aggressive (or coerced, induced) proselytisation could have been made more clearly.
    It also misses the angle of foreign funding of evangelical organisations (pl see http://satyameva-jayate.org/2010/03/31/foreign-funding/), which I believe is more of an immediate and potent threat.

    Comment by B Shantanu | September 9, 2014

  37. From “The mendacity of conversions”,a brief quote:


    Impact Nations organizes an annual ‘Journey of Compassion’. The one from 15 to 27 March 2015 will cost the participants $1,850. That is, you pay money to go to another poor country to harvest some souls. What better business model can you get? This is Proselytizing-Tourism!

    “We are so excited to be taking a team into the North of India, where we will be partnering with the largest church planting movement in India to bring healing, medicine, clean water and most importantly Jesus to the Punjab. Come and you will heal the sick, lead many to Jesus, give medicine and clean water to the sick and poor and be the face of Jesus to thousands.”

    The Journey Information Document even says this: “You should apply for a single entry, six months tourist visa (not a missionary visa). When asked the purpose for your visit, indicate ‘tourism’. If asked, the places of tourist Interest in Chandigarh are: Rock Garden, Sukhna Lake , Sector 17, IT Park, etc.”

    Comment by B Shantanu | December 19, 2014

  38. If you thought conversions and re-conversions are a “modern” problem, think again…
    Here’s Swami Vivekananda on Conversions, courtesy Sh S Gurumurthy:

    Vivekananda had warned against conversions. He said, “Every man going out of the Hindu pale is not only a man less, but an enemy the more.”
    ..
    I am not against any religion. But I am hostile to the Christian missionaries in India, said Vivekananda

    I protest against certain of the missionaries’ methods of raising money in America, said Vivekananda

    In The Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda” (v. 5, p. 233) Swami gives a detailed plan & procedure for what is today known as “Gharvapasi”

    Comment by B Shantanu | December 22, 2014

  39. Placing this link here for the record: Anti-Christian acts: The myth and reality, February 25, 2015 by Vivek Gumaste

    Comment by B Shantanu | February 27, 2015

  40. Excellent fact-based piece, richly referenced: “Hindus are on the Hit List” by Sumedha Sarvadaman

    Comment by B Shantanu | April 6, 2015

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