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	<title>Comments on: On Puritanism, Sex Addicts and Temples</title>
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		<title>By: Sid</title>
		<link>http://satyameva-jayate.org/2009/10/29/puritanism-temples/comment-page-1/#comment-65142</link>
		<dc:creator>Sid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Mar 2010 16:16:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://satyameva-jayate.org/?p=4763#comment-65142</guid>
		<description>Shantanu,
Let us give Doniger a rest. A lot of people made their points. People like R Malhotra and A Banerjee did their best to shred her supposedly &quot;reputation&quot; into pieces. I think a person of any national origin interested in Indology would know her name just by reading our criticism of hers. I really do not think that that sex-obsessed fool deserves more attention than what we already gave her. 

A far more dangerous, knowledgeable, well-reputed and intelligent adversary is Michael Witzel, a man who stands like the biggest roadblock against destroying the Aryan myth (Romila Thapars gain support from people like them). 

I rarely hear criticism of him. When I see the news like this:

http://intellibriefs.blogspot.com/2009/07/michael-witzel-rattled-rat-at-iic.html

I feel good, but this is not enough !!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shantanu,<br />
Let us give Doniger a rest. A lot of people made their points. People like R Malhotra and A Banerjee did their best to shred her supposedly &#8220;reputation&#8221; into pieces. I think a person of any national origin interested in Indology would know her name just by reading our criticism of hers. I really do not think that that sex-obsessed fool deserves more attention than what we already gave her. </p>
<p>A far more dangerous, knowledgeable, well-reputed and intelligent adversary is Michael Witzel, a man who stands like the biggest roadblock against destroying the Aryan myth (Romila Thapars gain support from people like them). </p>
<p>I rarely hear criticism of him. When I see the news like this:</p>
<p><a href="http://intellibriefs.blogspot.com/2009/07/michael-witzel-rattled-rat-at-iic.html" rel="nofollow">http://intellibriefs.blogspot.com/2009/07/michael-witzel-rattled-rat-at-iic.html</a></p>
<p>I feel good, but this is not enough !!!</p>
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		<title>By: B Shantanu</title>
		<link>http://satyameva-jayate.org/2009/10/29/puritanism-temples/comment-page-1/#comment-65094</link>
		<dc:creator>B Shantanu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Mar 2010 06:25:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://satyameva-jayate.org/?p=4763#comment-65094</guid>
		<description>Another rebuttal: &lt;a href=&quot;http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/panelists/aseem_shukla/2010/03/whose_history_is_it_anyways.html
&quot;&gt;Whose history is it anyway?&lt;/a&gt; by Dr. Aseem Shukla. 
Excerpts: 

...I revisit her (Wendy Doniger) work now not just because Doniger provokes so many of us in the Hindu American community. Doniger represents what many believe to be a fundamental flaw in the academic study of Hinduism: that Hindu studies is too often the last refuge of idiosyncratic and irreligious academics presenting themselves as &quot;experts&quot; on a faith that they study without the insight, recognition or reverence of, in this case, a practicing Hindu or even non-Hindu--striving to study Hinduism from the insider&#039;s perspective--would offer.

...&quot;Tell me where I have interpreted something wrong,&quot; Doniger challenged her critics and the gauntlet was picked up. Factual inaccuracies in her latest book were detailed in a prominent Indian media outlet, and a lay historian, Vishal Agarwal, posted a detailed, chapter by chapter riposte to Doniger&#039;s history that has been widely circulated. Not phrased in the niceties of academic parlance, perhaps, but Agarwal&#039;s methodical work opens the door to questions about Doniger&#039;s research, attention to detail, methodology, and more disturbingly, intentions behind her latest venture. Another detailed rebuttal to a single chapter spanning over twenty-two pages was posted by another writer this week.

Parallelisms in her book conjure up obsolete anecdotes comparing the sacred stone linga representing Lord Shiva to a leather strap-on sex toy, and Lord Rama, one of the most widely worshiped deities, is psychoanalyzed to have acted out of fear that he was becoming a sex-addict like his father. As Agarwal shows, Doniger&#039;s prose is replete with cutesy, perhaps, but offensive and jejune turns of phrases such as, &quot;If the motto of Watergate was &#039;Follow the money&#039;, the motto of the history of Hinduism could well be &#039;Follow the monkey&#039; or, more often &#039;Follow the horse&#039;.&quot; And in another section, her interpretations of the Rig Veda, the most ancient of the Vedas that Hindus consider sacred, Doniger sees incest and adultery with a pregnant woman in a verse praying to God for protection and safe delivery.

...Whether such a licentious foray into Hinduism studies is protected by free speech is not the question. Doniger can write and believe what she wishes. But Hindus are asking if publishers should bear responsiblity for copious factual and interpretive errors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another rebuttal: <a href="http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/panelists/aseem_shukla/2010/03/whose_history_is_it_anyways.html<br />
">Whose history is it anyway?</a> by Dr. Aseem Shukla.<br />
Excerpts: </p>
<p>&#8230;I revisit her (Wendy Doniger) work now not just because Doniger provokes so many of us in the Hindu American community. Doniger represents what many believe to be a fundamental flaw in the academic study of Hinduism: that Hindu studies is too often the last refuge of idiosyncratic and irreligious academics presenting themselves as &#8220;experts&#8221; on a faith that they study without the insight, recognition or reverence of, in this case, a practicing Hindu or even non-Hindu&#8211;striving to study Hinduism from the insider&#8217;s perspective&#8211;would offer.</p>
<p>&#8230;&#8221;Tell me where I have interpreted something wrong,&#8221; Doniger challenged her critics and the gauntlet was picked up. Factual inaccuracies in her latest book were detailed in a prominent Indian media outlet, and a lay historian, Vishal Agarwal, posted a detailed, chapter by chapter riposte to Doniger&#8217;s history that has been widely circulated. Not phrased in the niceties of academic parlance, perhaps, but Agarwal&#8217;s methodical work opens the door to questions about Doniger&#8217;s research, attention to detail, methodology, and more disturbingly, intentions behind her latest venture. Another detailed rebuttal to a single chapter spanning over twenty-two pages was posted by another writer this week.</p>
<p>Parallelisms in her book conjure up obsolete anecdotes comparing the sacred stone linga representing Lord Shiva to a leather strap-on sex toy, and Lord Rama, one of the most widely worshiped deities, is psychoanalyzed to have acted out of fear that he was becoming a sex-addict like his father. As Agarwal shows, Doniger&#8217;s prose is replete with cutesy, perhaps, but offensive and jejune turns of phrases such as, &#8220;If the motto of Watergate was &#8216;Follow the money&#8217;, the motto of the history of Hinduism could well be &#8216;Follow the monkey&#8217; or, more often &#8216;Follow the horse&#8217;.&#8221; And in another section, her interpretations of the Rig Veda, the most ancient of the Vedas that Hindus consider sacred, Doniger sees incest and adultery with a pregnant woman in a verse praying to God for protection and safe delivery.</p>
<p>&#8230;Whether such a licentious foray into Hinduism studies is protected by free speech is not the question. Doniger can write and believe what she wishes. But Hindus are asking if publishers should bear responsiblity for copious factual and interpretive errors.</p>
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		<title>By: B Shantanu</title>
		<link>http://satyameva-jayate.org/2009/10/29/puritanism-temples/comment-page-1/#comment-64168</link>
		<dc:creator>B Shantanu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 18:36:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://satyameva-jayate.org/?p=4763#comment-64168</guid>
		<description>Another critique of Wendy Doniger: &lt;a href=&quot;http://inquest-chitra.blogspot.com/2010/03/calling-her-bluff.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Calling her bluff&lt;/a&gt;

Do read. It is well-reasearched and makes a number of good points.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another critique of Wendy Doniger: <a href="http://inquest-chitra.blogspot.com/2010/03/calling-her-bluff.html" rel="nofollow">Calling her bluff</a></p>
<p>Do read. It is well-reasearched and makes a number of good points.</p>
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		<title>By: B Shantanu</title>
		<link>http://satyameva-jayate.org/2009/10/29/puritanism-temples/comment-page-1/#comment-62209</link>
		<dc:creator>B Shantanu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 19:08:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://satyameva-jayate.org/?p=4763#comment-62209</guid>
		<description>Thanks to Dr Kalyanaraman-ji for alerting me to &lt;a href=&quot;http://vishalagarwal.voiceofdharma.com/articles/thaah/ 
&quot;&gt;Vishal Agarwal&#039;s &quot;remarkably precise and well-documented preliminary review&quot;&lt;/a&gt; of Wendy Doniger&#039;s book that highlights a series of errors in interpretation and occassionally gross distortion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks to Dr Kalyanaraman-ji for alerting me to <a href="http://vishalagarwal.voiceofdharma.com/articles/thaah/<br />
">Vishal Agarwal&#8217;s &#8220;remarkably precise and well-documented preliminary review&#8221;</a> of Wendy Doniger&#8217;s book that highlights a series of errors in interpretation and occassionally gross distortion.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: B Shantanu</title>
		<link>http://satyameva-jayate.org/2009/10/29/puritanism-temples/comment-page-1/#comment-50951</link>
		<dc:creator>B Shantanu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 05:54:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://satyameva-jayate.org/?p=4763#comment-50951</guid>
		<description>Excerpts from &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.sandeepweb.com/2009/11/25/wendy-doniger-is-a-syndrome/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Wendy Doniger is a Syndrome&lt;/a&gt; by Sandeep:

...But it is truly amazing how Doniger manages to brand even serious and erudite scholars who criticize her work as fanatics, Hindutva agents, right-wingers and BJP members. This form of branding is, unless I’m mistaken, a tactic perfected by the Communists: recall Lenin’s famous technique of “sticking the convict badge” on his opponents. Of course, I don’t imply that Doniger is a Communist but the tactic is eerily familiar.

Indology was flawed from the start

Wendy Doniger’s credentials are pretty hoary–with numerous seminars and papers and books and publications in scholarly journals to her credit. As an Indology expert and scholar, she has peer-reviewed other scholarly work but has consistently shown intolerance towards criticism of her work by (mostly) Indian scholars. As Rajiv Malhotra and others have shown on several occasions, this phenomenon owes to an imbalance in the academic narrative and is fundamentally about power.

The element of power dates back to the founding days where entire departments of Indology, Sanskrit, and Oriental studies were liberally funded by the British colonial administration. They were liberally funded because British imperialism needed these Indologists to interpret the local customs and laws that in turn helped them shape policies to rule over the natives (sic). Indologists were naturally obliged to keep their masters happy. From the time of William Jones, who is justifiably called the father of (modern) Indology right up to the likes of Wendy Doniger and Michael Witzel, the research, narrative, and interpretation was, unsurprisingly, colonial in both colour and flavour–Eurocentric, if you will. It was not so much from a spirit of free and objective inquiry that research in Indology progressed but more to meet political and missionary ends. This trend continues today where new scholarly papers and books are written with an express intent to “reinterpret” or provide an “alternative interpretation” of Indian mythology, the Vedas, Puranas, symbolism, sages, Gods, and Goddesses.

It is therefore no coincidence–or any sinister cabal at work–that almost all of these scholarly works meet with such intense criticism by not just scholars but by practicing Hindus. The answer to that is found in Aurobindo’s caution: in his time, he said that these [scholars] lacked the background necessary to properly read this largely spiritual literature [Vedas]. Aurobindo spoke on the authority of the native Indian tradition, which prescribes the prerequisites to understand and interpret these texts. In general, anybody who wants to write any commentary or similar work, especially on the Vedas should at the minimum know these Vedangas (literally, the limbs of the Vedas) apart from knowing the Vedas themselves:

    * Shiksha : phonetics and phonology (sandhi)
    * Chandas : meter
    * Vyakarana: grammar
    * Nirukta: etymology
    * Jyotisha: astrology and astronomy, dealing particularly with the auspicious days for performing sacrifices.
    * Kalpa: ritual

Every single work that is considered as authoritative today by Hindus stem from this tradition–from the three major schools and other work by later scholars demonstrate adherence to these prerequisites. Works by scholars in British-ruled India like Ananda Coomaraswamy, M.Hiriyanna, P.V. Kane, and Ramana Maharshi (who largely spoke through silence and in the oral tradition) contain the same strand of fidelity to this tradition. These prerequisites is also known in general as Adhikari bheda, which simply means that a student should first successfully complete all the previous courses before attempting to sit for an Engineering exam.

This lack of knowledge of these prerequisites is a highly notable feature of Western Indology. Their claim of scholarship and/or expertise in Indology rests almost wholly on their knowledge of Sanskrit. But as we’ve seen above, mere knowledge of the language of Sanskrit isn’t enough. It sometimes leads to &lt;a href=&quot;http://varnam.nationalinterest.in/2009/02/how-old-are-our-mantras/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;rather laughable results&lt;/a&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Having established this similarity between bird song and mantra, the theory then takes off with a life of its own. There are vedic rituals for making rain and curing illness and similarly birds sing for building nests or attracting females; there are rituals and bird songs for various occasions. Then it was also found that bird sing – believe it or not – just for pleasure. So Staal extends the theory to say that, similar to skiing, dancing and music, mantras and rituals too are done for pleasure.

Between Staal’s athirathram in 1975 and Wood’s in 2006, one was held in 1990 near Thrissur which I attended for a day. This athirathram, which was extensively covered in Malayalam newspapers, was highly respectful and the words I heard were not “playful” or “pleasurable.” I can understand singing for pleasure, but am yet to meet a priest who said, “it’s a weekend and raining outside, let’s do a ganapati homam for pleasure.” [Ed: A highly recommended reading]&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Besides, there’s an entire cultural, philosophical, and spiritual heritage that cannot be understood merely in theory and bookish learning–it requires living the tradition. Even their knowledge of Sanskrit is suspect–for someone who holds sufficiently intimidating titles such as Mircea Eliade Distinguished Professor of the History of Religions, it is rather shameful to commit such &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?262511&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;blunders&lt;/a&gt;:
&lt;blockquote&gt;According to Doniger, the concept of a “sex-addict” is introduced into the Valmiki Ramayana by Lakshmana calling Dasaratha kama-sakta, which she defines as “hopelessly attached to lust.”

It is not clear where Doniger picks up the term ‘kama-sakta‘-the term does not appear upon a search of the text of the Valmiki Ramayana as given in the Titus online database, which is based on the following version of the text: G.H. Bhatt e.a., The Valmiki Ramayana, (Baroda 1960-1975), prepared by Muneo Tokunaga, March 12, 1993 (adaptations by John D. Smith, Cambridge, 1995.)…I will give the benefit of the doubt to Doniger and assume that the term kama-sakta has been used by Lakshmana to describe Dasaratha in the Valmiki-Ramayana. That in and of itself does not imply that Dasaratha was “hopelessly addicted to lust.” Kama-sakta simply means an attachment (sakta) to desire (kama). Kamadoes not itself necessarily refer to sexual desire, or even erotic or romantic desire. Dasaratha’s reluctance to allow Rama to serve as guard over Vishwamitra’s yajna, for example, or Lakshmana’s unwillingness to be parted from Rama, could equally be characterized as kama-sakta. To assume it to mean “attachment to lust” is another in a pattern of Doniger’s ex-cathedra translations in variance with traditional Sanskrit nirukta (etymology) for which she has been repudiated before.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

[Aside: For a more detailed treatment of her Sanskrit knowledge, &lt;a href=&quot;http://rajivmalhotra.sulekha.com/blog/post/2002/09/risa-lila-1-wendy-s-child-syndrome.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;this&lt;/a&gt; is a good place to head to.]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excerpts from <a href="http://www.sandeepweb.com/2009/11/25/wendy-doniger-is-a-syndrome/" rel="nofollow">Wendy Doniger is a Syndrome</a> by Sandeep:</p>
<p>&#8230;But it is truly amazing how Doniger manages to brand even serious and erudite scholars who criticize her work as fanatics, Hindutva agents, right-wingers and BJP members. This form of branding is, unless I’m mistaken, a tactic perfected by the Communists: recall Lenin’s famous technique of “sticking the convict badge” on his opponents. Of course, I don’t imply that Doniger is a Communist but the tactic is eerily familiar.</p>
<p>Indology was flawed from the start</p>
<p>Wendy Doniger’s credentials are pretty hoary–with numerous seminars and papers and books and publications in scholarly journals to her credit. As an Indology expert and scholar, she has peer-reviewed other scholarly work but has consistently shown intolerance towards criticism of her work by (mostly) Indian scholars. As Rajiv Malhotra and others have shown on several occasions, this phenomenon owes to an imbalance in the academic narrative and is fundamentally about power.</p>
<p>The element of power dates back to the founding days where entire departments of Indology, Sanskrit, and Oriental studies were liberally funded by the British colonial administration. They were liberally funded because British imperialism needed these Indologists to interpret the local customs and laws that in turn helped them shape policies to rule over the natives (sic). Indologists were naturally obliged to keep their masters happy. From the time of William Jones, who is justifiably called the father of (modern) Indology right up to the likes of Wendy Doniger and Michael Witzel, the research, narrative, and interpretation was, unsurprisingly, colonial in both colour and flavour–Eurocentric, if you will. It was not so much from a spirit of free and objective inquiry that research in Indology progressed but more to meet political and missionary ends. This trend continues today where new scholarly papers and books are written with an express intent to “reinterpret” or provide an “alternative interpretation” of Indian mythology, the Vedas, Puranas, symbolism, sages, Gods, and Goddesses.</p>
<p>It is therefore no coincidence–or any sinister cabal at work–that almost all of these scholarly works meet with such intense criticism by not just scholars but by practicing Hindus. The answer to that is found in Aurobindo’s caution: in his time, he said that these [scholars] lacked the background necessary to properly read this largely spiritual literature [Vedas]. Aurobindo spoke on the authority of the native Indian tradition, which prescribes the prerequisites to understand and interpret these texts. In general, anybody who wants to write any commentary or similar work, especially on the Vedas should at the minimum know these Vedangas (literally, the limbs of the Vedas) apart from knowing the Vedas themselves:</p>
<p>    * Shiksha : phonetics and phonology (sandhi)<br />
    * Chandas : meter<br />
    * Vyakarana: grammar<br />
    * Nirukta: etymology<br />
    * Jyotisha: astrology and astronomy, dealing particularly with the auspicious days for performing sacrifices.<br />
    * Kalpa: ritual</p>
<p>Every single work that is considered as authoritative today by Hindus stem from this tradition–from the three major schools and other work by later scholars demonstrate adherence to these prerequisites. Works by scholars in British-ruled India like Ananda Coomaraswamy, M.Hiriyanna, P.V. Kane, and Ramana Maharshi (who largely spoke through silence and in the oral tradition) contain the same strand of fidelity to this tradition. These prerequisites is also known in general as Adhikari bheda, which simply means that a student should first successfully complete all the previous courses before attempting to sit for an Engineering exam.</p>
<p>This lack of knowledge of these prerequisites is a highly notable feature of Western Indology. Their claim of scholarship and/or expertise in Indology rests almost wholly on their knowledge of Sanskrit. But as we’ve seen above, mere knowledge of the language of Sanskrit isn’t enough. It sometimes leads to <a href="http://varnam.nationalinterest.in/2009/02/how-old-are-our-mantras/" rel="nofollow">rather laughable results</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>Having established this similarity between bird song and mantra, the theory then takes off with a life of its own. There are vedic rituals for making rain and curing illness and similarly birds sing for building nests or attracting females; there are rituals and bird songs for various occasions. Then it was also found that bird sing – believe it or not – just for pleasure. So Staal extends the theory to say that, similar to skiing, dancing and music, mantras and rituals too are done for pleasure.</p>
<p>Between Staal’s athirathram in 1975 and Wood’s in 2006, one was held in 1990 near Thrissur which I attended for a day. This athirathram, which was extensively covered in Malayalam newspapers, was highly respectful and the words I heard were not “playful” or “pleasurable.” I can understand singing for pleasure, but am yet to meet a priest who said, “it’s a weekend and raining outside, let’s do a ganapati homam for pleasure.” [Ed: A highly recommended reading]</p></blockquote>
<p>Besides, there’s an entire cultural, philosophical, and spiritual heritage that cannot be understood merely in theory and bookish learning–it requires living the tradition. Even their knowledge of Sanskrit is suspect–for someone who holds sufficiently intimidating titles such as Mircea Eliade Distinguished Professor of the History of Religions, it is rather shameful to commit such <a href="http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?262511" rel="nofollow">blunders</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>According to Doniger, the concept of a “sex-addict” is introduced into the Valmiki Ramayana by Lakshmana calling Dasaratha kama-sakta, which she defines as “hopelessly attached to lust.”</p>
<p>It is not clear where Doniger picks up the term ‘kama-sakta‘-the term does not appear upon a search of the text of the Valmiki Ramayana as given in the Titus online database, which is based on the following version of the text: G.H. Bhatt e.a., The Valmiki Ramayana, (Baroda 1960-1975), prepared by Muneo Tokunaga, March 12, 1993 (adaptations by John D. Smith, Cambridge, 1995.)…I will give the benefit of the doubt to Doniger and assume that the term kama-sakta has been used by Lakshmana to describe Dasaratha in the Valmiki-Ramayana. That in and of itself does not imply that Dasaratha was “hopelessly addicted to lust.” Kama-sakta simply means an attachment (sakta) to desire (kama). Kamadoes not itself necessarily refer to sexual desire, or even erotic or romantic desire. Dasaratha’s reluctance to allow Rama to serve as guard over Vishwamitra’s yajna, for example, or Lakshmana’s unwillingness to be parted from Rama, could equally be characterized as kama-sakta. To assume it to mean “attachment to lust” is another in a pattern of Doniger’s ex-cathedra translations in variance with traditional Sanskrit nirukta (etymology) for which she has been repudiated before.</p></blockquote>
<p>[Aside: For a more detailed treatment of her Sanskrit knowledge, <a href="http://rajivmalhotra.sulekha.com/blog/post/2002/09/risa-lila-1-wendy-s-child-syndrome.htm" rel="nofollow">this</a> is a good place to head to.]</p>
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